LineSpeakerSt TimeContentEn Time
1ROC_int_010.2918Do you consent to doing this interview?2.2875
5 3.9102great, [okay,]4.9453 
9 5.8068So, um,6.8653 
11 6.9772usually the first, um, question that I ask is about where you grew up in the city of Rochester.13.3456 
12ROC_se0_ag1_f_0213.7373Oh okay,14.2735
14 14.7631um, so I'm from- born and raised in Rochester.17.5737 
16 17.7789Um,18.3477 
18 18.7208I grew up on, uh, two-20.8632 
20 21.0467was it21.4405 
22 21.5773t- one- /RD-ADDRESS-6/.23.1867 
24 23.5166So it's in between /RD-ADDRESS-3/ and /RD-ADDRESS-2/ I think.26.0917 
26 26.5113And it was weird, cause I grew up in a house behind a house.28.7915 
28ROC_se0_ag1_f_0229.3312And I grew up across the street from a recreation center, that was really important to my development.34.0174
29 34.4499So I spent m- most of my time there. And then,37.1015
31 37.8911when I went to middle school, I moved /on/ /RD-ADDRESS-7/.41.6343 
33 42.1379Like by-42.9539 
35 43.2337off of /RD-ADDRESS-3/.44.1663 
37 44.4507So, kind of the same45.3320 
39 46.2287situation. A lot of crime, a lot of like,48.8746 
41 49.0348drugs and stuff like that.50.1616 
44 51.3703but yeah.51.9755
45ROC_int_0152.3753Well, how would you describe the neighborhood for someone who isn't here? Like, what does it look [like? /Is it like/ houses], or?58.0407
46ROC_se0_ag1_f_0256.2026[Oh, um],57.2620
47 58.1387well, the first house,59.3732
49 59.5000it was just weird because it was a- behind a house.61.8715 
51 62.2782So, it was cool because we had like a lot of,64.4045 
53 64.7064um, space to65.8162 
55 65.9467play and, like, run around and stuff like that.68.4880 
57 68.9310And, um,70.2739 
59 70.7448you know,71.4699 
61 71.9048it- it- like I said it was across the street from a recreation center, so it was like a basketball75.5185 
63 75.6910c- hoo- hoop and,77.1913 
65 77.5970uh, tennis, like a big field. I played football like, with the boys.81.7097 
67 82.0967There's a pool,83.1540 
69 83.5737um,84.5109 
71 87.5978there's like- you know, it's a food a desert. So, there's like a lot of corner stores, not like a lot of92.2036 
73 92.5859fresh93.0942 
75 93.2434produce, or any of that kind of stuff.95.1263 
77 95.7649Um, mostly black,97.6254 
79 97.9225poor98.5363 
81 98.7031people,99.2854 
83 99.7750uh, for the most part. Um,101.7462 
85 102.8327yeah, and it was like right,103.9331 
87 104.2493um, like down a hill, it was like also next to a hill, like we ride our bikes down.108.3058 
89 108.8467Um, and it was next to my elementary school.110.8284 
91 111.0102And then I would walk to112.3392 
93 112.9442my middle school, that was kind of far.114.1892 
95 114.3757Um,114.9259 
97 116.1196and then the other street,117.4204 
99 117.6640um,118.2413 
101 119.3359was kind of a similar situation. It was next to another school.122.6092 
103 123.1921Um, but it was a lot more crime there, a lot more abandoned houses. Um,127.2523 
105 127.5927that was mostly a black neighborhood as well.129.8915 
107 130.4604Uh, again a food desert, like I- my mom didn't have a car growing up. So, like that was really,135.1734 
109 135.9708uh, tough trying to get like fresh c-137.5504 
111 137.7695produce and all that kind of stuff.139.1105 
113 139.8119Um,140.5486 
115 141.4765yeah.141.8309 
118 142.7304It's interesting you143.7563 
120 143.9987bring up the food desert point because145.8779 
122 146.1437like, that's not something I realized until I became an adult.149.6071 
123ROC_se0_ag1_f_02149.6397Yeah, yeah.150.3764
124ROC_int_01150.5629You know how few152.1390
126 152.4468grocery stores that there are just period in the city, [and even]156.5797 
128ROC_int_01156.6931the Wegmans on Mount Hope157.9743
132ROC_int_01159.4493[So, yeah.]160.0415
133ROC_se0_ag1_f_02160.0357A lot of the Wegmans move out the ho-161.1967
134 161.2946moved out the hood. [I actually] just- m-163.0292
136ROC_se0_ag1_f_02163.2204g- went163.6662
138 163.7702to Wegmans earlier,164.7268 
140 165.3467um, to get like a sub cause I love the subs, [but.]167.7869 
141ROC_int_01167.5231[Yes, me too.]168.3149
142ROC_se0_ag1_f_02167.9404[Yeah.] <laugh>168.6842
143 168.9593But then I realized, like,169.9837
145 170.4141you know, I was thinking about that, I was talking, um, uh, with172.8004 
147 172.9309my friend who also grew up, uh, in Rochester. She has a different experience cause she grew up like in the177.1509 
149 177.4819suburbs, stuff like that. But we both went to, um, /RD-SCHOOL-3/.180.5396 
151 181.0852And, uh, I was like, yo where's like, uh, (laughing) the closest Wegmans? Like, I really wanna go to Wegmans.185.9387 
153 186.4137Um, and yeah, the closest one is like,189.0809 
155 189.2103n- nowhere near,190.7071 
157 190.8627it's like twenty minute drive, you know.192.3718 
159 192.8800Um, so yeah.194.0266 
160ROC_int_01194.5773Yeah, and then I think there's maybe a Price Right in-197.7609
161ROC_se0_ag1_f_02198.0920Uh, not near me, /none that-/ [I have like-]200.5214
165 201.6078t- I remember to like go to a grocery store, it was always a big hassle because205.5701 
167 205.9245my mom didn't have a car. And like, you really need a car to live in Rochester,209.3086 
169 209.7469you know. And so, like,210.9966 
171 211.1178she would either have to212.5354 
173 212.7638barter with like neighbors, and like, pay them money,215.3459 
175 215.4718for gas money when she had it,216.9313 
177 217.4163or like, ask a relative, but we still had to actually pay them. And it- it like- the closest grocery was like maybe a fifteen, twenty minute drive at least.224.0831 
179ROC_se0_ag1_f_02224.7872And it's like not the best. Like, Tops is like dirty and like, not- <laugh>228.6842
181ROC_se0_ag1_f_02229.1971[Um], so yeah.230.5447
182ROC_int_01230.7685Yeah, yeah.231.7337
184 232.0883So you mention the, uh, recreation center [across the street.] Do you wanna talk more, like maybe your experiences there, [/or/?]239.3411 
185ROC_se0_ag1_f_02234.8987[Yeah, yeah.]235.7473
187 239.0615[Yeah], I mean, I- um,240.6982 
188 240.8660I spent a lot of time there. So, my mom, it was, uh, it- it was just my mom,244.6978
190 245.4112uh, my twin brother, I had a older brother and a sister,249.1669 
192 249.3232and a nephew.250.2500 
194 250.6372And so, my mom would work a lot and stuff like that. And so, I actually spent a lot of my time there.255.4359 
196 256.0123Um,256.7724 
198 257.5091like,257.9131 
200 258.2340I started going there from five, up until like260.7592 
202 261.2721I actually started working there when I was in, uh, high school,263.9008 
204ROC_se0_ag1_f_02264.4697[as soon] as I could. Um, I really enjoyed266.8781
205 267.0112going there.267.7274
207 268.3014Um,269.0428 
209 269.2387you know, just, I played a lot of sports.271.4023 
211 271.5981Uh, I usually was probably the only girl that273.9156 
213 274.3288like, got dirty and all that kind of stuff. And I would276.2799 
215 276.6329swim everyday, like I just- I just was really involved279.7990 
217 279.9657in that280.3755 
219 280.7677community center. And then when- as soon as I was old enough I started working there,283.9991 
221 284.3768uh, with the kids, and286.0321 
223 286.4600I think that's when I began to realize the kind of neighborhood that289.6308 
225 290.1017I was living in. Cause [you- you] know, you don't- you think everybody-293.8309 
227ROC_se0_ag1_f_02294.3298You know, I just /grew up with/ my mom. So I thought295.7380
229 295.9199everybody didn't have like, a dad around as much. Or, you know, they weren't that involved. Like,300.3624 
231 300.7215you know, that's when I feel like I start- started to learn303.3234 
233 303.9062like what kind of environment I was really in.305.9894 
235 306.5629But it wasn't until I got to /RD-SCHOOL-3/ that I was like, dang, I was really poor. <laugh>311.3459 
237 311.6863[Like it was just such a stark] difference that like,313.7029 
239ROC_se0_ag1_f_02314.1437people actually paid cash for tuition. I'm like,316.7915
241 316.8979what?317.1874 
243 317.7423Um, and stuff like that. And so,319.5608 
245 319.8219all- I think all those different moments I started to realize, like, oh okay, I-323.9101 
247 324.8707dang, I- I really did grow up, like, in a- a dis-327.8316 
249 327.9517from a disadvantaged background but I didn't329.4205 
251 329.7609realize the extent to it, because everyone around me was just in the same environment.333.6684 
256 335.6549No that makes sense.336.7914 
258 336.9047And so, what schools did you go to? Did you go to [ones in the] neighborhood, or?340.6036 
260 340.6083Yeah, yeah. So I went to /RD-SCHOOL-4/ School,343.3556
262 343.4862/RD-SCHOOL-7/. So that's the school I was saying like,346.2500 
264 346.4693there's a recreation center- actually it was connected to a recreation center.349.1505 
266ROC_se0_ag1_f_02349.6354So, um, like the gym, they shared the same gym and stuff like that. So, I went353.1454
268 353.3040to /RD-SCHOOL-4/ School.354.6282 
270 355.1365And then I went to /RD-SCHOOL-11/ which I think is like, in a lot of trouble now.360.3718 
272 361.0432Um, and then I went to /RD-SCHOOL-3/,363.4073 
274 363.7699um, for364.7491 
276 365.2531high school. And that was really-367.0548 
278 367.2283and it- So,367.8789 
280 368.2509those-368.6379 
282 368.8151the /RD-SCHOOL-2/ School was really close. I could just,370.7351 
284 370.8326walk up the hill. Like, my mom took me to like, the first day and then she's like, okay you got it, you know.374.9737 
286ROC_se0_ag1_f_02375.4572[And] then, um, middle school was actually like, kind of far. Like,378.3839
287 378.4977I mean, I guess considering at the time. But I had a twin brother,381.2628
289 381.6731so we, you know, stuck together and like /walked/ home all the time.385.7088 
291 386.1017And that was like, probably like, a mile, or two.389.1734 
293 389.8076Um,390.3951 
295 390.5210you know, in the winters it was a little hectic, but, uh, it wasn't too bad.393.6218 
297 394.2128But then when we moved to the /RD-ADDRESS-3/396.4768 
299 396.6990address it was closer. And then /RD-SCHOOL-1/ I had to399.1731 
301 399.4204catch a bus.400.0695 
303 400.5346And I went there because they had the /RD-SCHOOL-7/. It's like this program for people404.6389 
305 405.0296who wanna become teachers in the city s- Rochester city school district and that's what I thought initially I wanted to do.409.9385 
307 410.3115So that's why I went to high school411.4898 
309 411.7151there. Even though it was kind of far, cause I was413.8252 
311 414.1278thinking about going to /RD-SCHOOL-2/,415.5515 
313 415.9292uh, /RD-SCHOOL-4/,417.2010 
316ROC_int_01417.9984yeah. Okay, and how did you enjoy /RD-SCHOOL-1/? What was that experience like for you?422.5307
319 424.2082it was challenging because426.4008 
321 426.8012I think at that point, um, so when I entered, I was like thirteen,431.1035 
323 431.3273thirteen or fourteen.432.2459 
325 432.6003And I think at that point I started to realize that,434.9597 
327 435.7011you know,436.3760 
329 436.5253not everybody's-437.5065 
331 437.6117So, like,438.3065 
333 438.5769uh, let me take a step back. So,439.8219 
335 440.3209I would participate in different community service activities. So, one of the things that we did is like,444.9826 
337 445.3090interact with like, um, sch- students that went to like suburban high schools.449.3646 
339 449.7889And so I think like going to their facilities and stuff like that, I noticed-453.5332 
341 453.7011like started to notice differences between like, the schools,456.4790 
343 456.9640like, my school and their school. So like,458.1996 
345 458.7172my school, you know, soon as you walk- before you can get into the school you have to go through medical- medical- uh,464.1204 
347 464.4328<ts>464.5363 
349ROC_se0_ag1_f_02465.0246[metal dete- detectors], yeah.466.7076
351ROC_se0_ag1_f_02467.2060Uh, like, literally like, airport style. Like you walk through, like it was really intense. Um,472.1207
353 473.1501uh, but-474.4744 
355 475.1831and so like, stuff like that. But- and I played like three sports all my four years.479.4718 
357 480.1666And um,481.3277 
359 481.5888I had482.0038 
361 482.5120good friends and good teachers.484.4040 
363 484.8004Um, but-485.7190 
365 486.5350and I did well in school, I don't think I struggled at all I think489.2087 
367 489.2877in fact I probably wasn't challenged enough a lot of times.492.2832 
369 493.0292Um,493.8173 
371 495.6915but,496.0281 
373 496.1926I definitely496.9636 
375 497.3366m- I-497.8076 
377 498.4091towards the end I definitely knew like-499.9012 
379 500.7405<ts>500.9099 
381 501.5985So I- and so then I met like503.1229 
383 503.6334really good teachers like that went to /RD-SCHOOL-10/.506.1950 
385 506.5913And so I was first pe- person in my family to go to college, and I didn't realize like how-510.3858 
387 510.9686um,511.5515 
389 512.9037how513.4027 
391 513.7057great of a school /RD-SCHOOL-3/ was. Cause my mom actually worked there as a janitor for a long time.517.7753 
393 518.2882And, you know, it's unfortunate because I lived so close521.0829 
395 521.5837there.521.9801 
397 522.3531By the time I was going, uh, to college, like I could- I lived right around the corner from the riverside.526.8470 
399 527.3319I think /it has/ apartments like literally one block away.529.4769 
401 530.0504And, um,530.8105 
403 531.6405you know, just not knowing all those resources. But I think534.1619 
405 534.5956I had really good teachers who,536.2929 
407 536.5913uh, really were invested in me. And- and saw something maybe at times I didn't see in myself.541.1344 
409 541.6354Um, and I ha- I didn't have many black teachers /like/ I can only recall like maybe two, and one of them actually passed away,547.3556 
411 547.9665uh, whe- as we were graduating /RD-NAME-5/.550.4456 
413 550.6002Um,551.0568 
415 551.6445but he went to /RD-SCHOOL-3/. He had, um, a brother, /RD-NAME-5/ at-555.6918 
417 556.0788I don't know if you remember him,557.2991 
419 557.3715uh, but he,558.5256 
421 559.0526uh,559.6587 
423 560.0551you know, I met at /RD-SCHOOL-3/ so that was really good. And so, just having those teachers encourage me I think made a565.7893 
425 566.2355huge difference in a lot of different stuff.567.9902 
426ROC_int_01568.2315Yeah, [yeah], okay, cool.570.2599
428ROC_int_01570.6189Um, and so, had you always wanted to go to /RD-SCHOOL-3/? Or what [were your-]575.5884
430 575.7003[<laugh> Um, so-]577.2437
432ROC_se0_ag1_f_02577.4675so, growing up in the environment I grew up in, I knew I had to get education. Like, I-582.5023
434 582.6189for me I saw that as the only way to584.6368 
436 585.7582do better in terms of the financial587.9592 
438 588.0480strain that my family was constantly in.590.4840 
440 591.0378Um, it-591.5848 
442 591.7465it's just s- school was something I always excelled in and pu- and put a lot of time and effort into.595.7893 
444 596.3348And so-597.0510 
446 597.1479hello,597.4647 
448 597.6869and so, um,598.6605 
450 599.6303um,600.3158 
452 601.2810so I always knew I wanted to go to college, but not necessarily /RD-SCHOOL-3/. Again, even though my mom worked there, I didn't actually know,607.0059 
454 607.6354um, the type of resources and stuff they had. I just knew it cost like fifty thousand to go there. And my mom made less than half613.9711 
456 614.5948of that.615.1310 
458 615.5600Uh, and I was like, there's no way I can afford to go there. And so,617.9707 
460 618.7961because at the time I wanted to be a teacher, I was like, oh maybe I'll go to like St. John Fisher, or some of the smaller schools, um,624.4650 
462 624.9359that had like scholarships and stuff like that for me. And627.8211 
464 628.3480I onl- l- I feel like the only reason I really applied to /RD-SCHOOL-3/ honestly is because of people like, um, /RD-NAME-5/ who I talked about before,635.0195 
466 635.4625just kind of encouraged me, and my other teachers,637.4768 
468 637.8538um, who went there,639.1128 
470 639.2620um, just telling me about their experience. And,641.5328 
472 641.8219so, I kind of applied just to appease their like,644.3586 
474 644.7771you know, (laughing) efforts in terms of trying to get me to apply.648.1390 
476ROC_se0_ag1_f_02648.6100And then when I got in and realized, oh, they're actually, like-650.9449
477 651.2200this might actually be a good place. And then,653.9152
479 654.4794I still actually was gonna pick St. John Fisher, but I remember talking to people and saying like, oh you know I got into /RD-SCHOOL-3/, but I'll probably go with660.9597 
481 661.2617St. John Fisher, and they're like, what? No, you need to go to /RD-SCHOOL-3/. And then I feel like everyone kept telling me, so I'm like-665.6914 
483 666.2229But for me it was enough667.3840 
485 667.6451for me just to go to college.669.4252 
487 669.5539At that time like I didn- I didn't-671.0339 
489 671.4862I mean, I was like,672.1996 
491 672.7079going to college is just a huge feat, just c- from the family I675.4485 
493 676.1753came from. And so,677.4442 
495 677.8313I think just like, talking to people and hearing their reaction,680.6976 
497 681.1035I was like, okay, I guess I'll go to /RD-SCHOOL-3/. Like, literally that's like why I went. That's why I chose that685.8736 
499 686.4460versus like St. John Fisher and it would ma- it made all the difference in terms of like,691.2534 
501 691.7197the692.1487 
503 692.3527things that I'm doing now, I don't think I woulda694.2524 
505 694.3479did those things, had I695.8872 
507 696.4001like went to a different school.697.8923 
509ROC_se0_ag1_f_02698.6465Um, and so I think just having,700.2412
511 700.4744uh,700.9080 
513 701.3790mentors, and people just kind of guiding me,704.1476 
515 704.4565an- and like expecting more from me, than I did at-707.3431 
517 707.4908for myself,708.4654 
519 708.8758I think made all the difference for me. (laughing)710.9967 
522ROC_int_01711.9754Um, for you, how was your first year adjusting [from like-]715.7565
526 718.3205[Um,]719.1458
527ROC_int_01718.3347[/?/ /RD-SCHOOL-1/]718.9227
528 719.2251cause you know I know about it, [/I think/ going to /RD-SCHOOL-2/] and [I mean, that's its own] kind of school, but.723.4238
529ROC_se0_ag1_f_02720.4686[yeah, yeah.]721.3374
531 721.6931[Yeah, yeah.]722.5451 
533 723.3972Yeah, yeah.724.3951 
534ROC_int_01724.5437[And, yeah.]725.3743
535ROC_se0_ag1_f_02724.6099[Yeah, ooh],725.3510
538 727.3281oh, I mean,728.1441
540 728.3819it was-729.3273 
542 729.9801it was challenging. It challenged me in every, uh,733.4726 
544 733.8270way.734.3119 
546 734.8517So, I remember the- Like, for example the firs- So I majored in mathematics and political science.740.1254 
548 740.6558So, you v-741.6482 
550 741.9195political science had somewhat,743.3417 
552 743.6354uh, more diverse students.745.3840 
554 745.9995Um, but,746.9263 
556 747.2807uh, math,748.2506 
558 749.0712I was,749.8499 
560 750.0551um, usually the only black student in my class. And so,753.0475 
562 753.6397um, I remember the first m- class I had,756.1717 
564 756.7545uh, was calculus one-forty-one,758.9449 
566 759.1361and759.5791 
568 759.9008the teacher was going around asking people what school they went to.762.1530 
570 762.7545Right?763.1742 
572 763.7058And,764.1021 
574 764.3900people were talking going to Exeter and all these schools I never heard of at the time. I didn't know767.9170 
576 768.0292the magnitude of like,768.9504 
578 769.4726you know, that people actually pay to go to high school, like what?771.9195 
580 772.3998But you know, people were saying all these schools I never heard of, and I remember775.2954 
582 775.7104it got around to me, and the teacher asked me like what school I went to, I was li- I was proud that I went to /RD-SCHOOL-1/. And I was like, you know, I went to /RD-SCHOOL-1/ High School.781.6032 
584 782.0042And I could tell on her face, there was this kind of look, and I was like, what? You know, I was kind of-785.9385 
586 786.1996you know, I didn't know that in terms of the norms, uh, again with the professor, like this-790.6224 
588 790.7355no one in my family went to college.792.1204 
590 792.3908So I said- I challenged her and said what? And she's like,794.3446 
592 794.6838oh, you know, I just don't think you're gonna make it as a math major.797.2259 
594 797.9572And she said this in front of the entire [class. <laugh>]800.4472 
596ROC_se0_ag1_f_02800.7818Yeah, um,802.0873
598 802.1806and I- I had- uh, I don't remember what I said at the time, but I s- I will- I didn't care, I said something back to her.807.0755 
600 807.5791And, but I was very hurt. And I remember going back to my dorm room and crying and calling my mom.812.2047 
602 812.4040<laugh>812.9356 
603ROC_int_01813.0568Like [just hearing that breaks] my heart.815.5049
606 814.1759[yeah.]814.7495 
607 815.5422<ts> Yeah,816.0831
609 816.5773uh, but you know what,817.9202 
611 818.1581it- it really,819.1687 
613 819.3879f- f- thankfully I'm the kind of person in which- I- when I'm challenged in that way,823.2954 
615 823.6405it actually-824.2653 
617 824.3997it824.5083 
619 824.8237propels me to work harder,826.6562 
621 827.0619and so,827.8219 
623 828.1406she was right in a sense that I was not prepared, um,831.0195 
625 831.3553for that class.832.5148 
627 832.8521Because w-833.3884 
629 833.5102uh, you know like, I took pre-calc, but it just-836.4425 
631 836.9543you know, /RD-SCHOOL-1/ did not prepare me for college. And so what I did was, I went to her class, /?/ uh,841.7431 
633 842.0974but I also went to another professor who was teaching it,844.2412 
635 844.7262and I would go,845.4862 
637 845.6494not getting credit for it,846.8897 
639 847.2581I w- I didn't- I don't even think I really told many peo- d- many people this, but850.3960 
641 850.7351I would go to his class, just to hear the lecture twice.854.0924 
643 854.7359And like go to office hours and things like that. And I got a A in- in her class and I think,859.1458 
645 859.7147in part it was because she told me861.3980 
647 861.5321that I couldn't.862.2315 
649 862.6185Um, and so I did- I end up doing well in that864.8726 
651 865.0003class and865.8406 
653 866.2276a lot of, uh, those math classes, I had very similar experiences. Nothing as daunting, or,870.4650 
655 871.0153um, traumatic I think, as that first experience, but I definitely had more implicit kind of,876.6562 
657 877.1085uh, racially, o- um,879.0856 
659 879.3514things happening in math classes. So, I'd often881.9008 
661 882.3251sit in the front row, um, to make- to make sure that, like, the professor knew I wasn't cheating. And,888.3904 
663 888.7168I felt like I often had to do different things that I- I know- knew for sure893.5045 
665 893.8589that my other classmates didn't have to be concerned about.896.3442 
667 896.7498Um,897.3887 
669 898.6372and so, yeah, it wa- it was really unfortunate. And901.8639 
671 902.0924political science to some extent was like that. I think904.5337 
673 904.9729it helped that there was more diverse, uh, students in that,908.2742 
675 908.4468um, major.909.2581 
677 909.7384And so often, I would have at least one or two other912.9406 
679 913.2810students, um, even in the higher level classes with me.916.4786 
681 916.9822Um,917.4532 
683 918.0276and I had one, uh, black female friend who920.8058 
685 921.0996was in political science that I think helped- we helped get each other through, like, those are higher level classes, where,925.6308 
687 926.0458it- we weren't like the only927.6278 
689 927.7649few students. But in my math classes,929.3319 
691 929.7330I felt930.3112 
693 930.6749li- like that first experience very similarly,933.1742 
695 933.5612uh, throughout all those fourteen classes I had to take.936.0920 
699 937.8126but938.1157 
701 938.5120outside of academics, I was really involved in the Black Student's Union and942.5583 
703 942.8894other, um, groups. And I think that really helped me946.2420 
705 947.1454to,947.8076 
707 948.1759um, understand,949.6214 
709 950.2789more about my identity and history and that952.7724 
711 953.1641it's-953.4439 
713 953.6910and to demand, like,954.9826 
715 955.3790justice and all these different things and that it's okay958.2921 
717 958.9403to- to be black on this campus and that,961.3230 
719 961.5795even though I know that for sure /that/ are people that don't want me there, like I can actually excel here and get something,967.2158 
721 967.6214uh, from this experience. And so,969.5425 
723 969.8037I think participating- I remember Jena Six happened. Um, like all these different things happened. We were doing protests and just,975.2488 
725 975.5565different stuff on campus and I think that really,977.7516 
727 978.4137uh, made me f- uh, enjoy my experience a lot more. So when I look back on my experience in college, I often984.9500 
729 985.4536think about BSU and all these other groups. I actually, went to an event they had,990.0547 
731 990.4464uh, for freshman, just to go because I was in town, and just to,994.1860 
733 994.7304you know, talk to the students there. And it's- and thankfully it's actually a lot more st- uh,998.9643 
735 999.3374black and Latino students now, than it definitely was when I was there.1003.0199 
737 1003.4302Um, um, so I think that was really comforting to see.1006.8610 
739 1007.1175Ooh sorry.1007.6149 
741 1007.8182But- um,1008.5909 
743 1009.0013uh,1009.5002 
745 1009.7893but yeah, it- uh, it was a crazy experience, and I think1013.0428 
747 1013.5651there's all these different mix of emotions that goes on. Like-1016.6473 
749 1017.0483then I get these e-mails about going (laughing) to a happy hour, or,1019.9428 
751 1020.3997anything like that. Like, I- uh, I'm in Washington DC and so,1023.5379 
753 1023.8736there's actually a lot of /RD-SCHOOL-3/ st- um, alumni students alumn- al- alumni, yeah,1029.1695 
755 1029.2907students, um,1030.1755 
757 1030.4880<ts>1030.6020 
759 1030.8652in DC.1031.7520 
761 1031.9316So they often have these, um,1033.7100 
763 1034.2975happy hours.1035.2843 
765 1036.1336And I'm always like,1037.3646 
767 1037.5634do I wanna go and be the only black person again, or?1040.6986 
769 1041.0949Like I know what kind of students go here. It's a bunch of Ivy League rejects who just think too highly of themself.1046.6689 
771 1046.9383So like, do I actually wanna be around that? Uh,1049.2107 
773 1049.7003um, you know, in the past I had to be around that, but do I actually wanna subject myself to that? But I'm glad I went to like one because1055.9148 
775 1056.2925there was other, like, um, students, like,1058.7825 
777 1058.9131black students that were there,1060.4040 
779 1060.6838that graduated b- before me, that happened to be there, that I think,1063.3650 
781 1063.6727had I not gone to that happy hour, I would not know they were actually in DC. And so it was really cool1068.1619 
783 1068.5676to reconnect with those people, but it still was the same thing all over again.1071.4400 
785 1072.2781Me sitting by myself, (laughing)1073.7796 
787 1074.1853the other black1074.9948 
789 1075.1289students coming, and being like, oh hey what's up? And like,1077.6488 
791 1077.9937actually talking to me and not,1079.4905 
793 1080.2226you know.1080.8660 
795 1081.2111Again, like,1081.9152 
797 1082.1110I was again, rendered invisible1084.2280 
799 1084.5766to these students. Um,1086.3485 
801 1086.9313and so, it sh- s-1088.3141 
803 1088.3931it's just like,1089.3467 
805 1089.8165hard,1090.4087 
807 1090.5999um,1091.0195 
809 1091.2946yeah.1091.6583 
810ROC_int_011091.6863Mm-hm. Now I've never gone to any in San [Francisco],1095.4881
811ROC_se0_ag1_f_021094.6846[<laugh> Yeah.]1095.8969
812ROC_int_011095.6677[cause] I'm just like,1096.5439
814ROC_int_011097.4159I doubt I'll know anybody, and if I go I1099.5655
816 1099.8732don't know if anybody will really talk to me, [you know],1102.4134 
820 1103.4718[<laugh>]1104.1060 
822ROC_int_011104.4277[I can totally I identify with that. That's] great.1106.8876
823ROC_se0_ag1_f_021104.5230[<laugh> Yes.]1106.5214
824ROC_int_011107.0720Now because you said this though, now I'm like oh, well maybe I should check it out. Maybe [like],1111.7805
828 1113.5892okay,1114.0042 
829ROC_se0_ag1_f_021114.0543I [think it might] be worth it. I was really shocked to- to see1117.1645
831ROC_se0_ag1_f_021117.5981like three or four people that I1119.4586
833 1120.0963knew in college, like, pretty well. And I had no idea that they were there.1123.4676 
835 1123.7893And I had just got to DC, so I was trying to kind of build my network,1127.1408 
837 1127.5418of people.1128.3764 
839 1129.1318Um, so I'm glad I went,1130.4794 
841ROC_se0_ag1_f_021131.2255you know.1131.6824
842ROC_int_011132.1820Okay, [that's cool.]1133.3553
844ROC_int_011134.0928[Well], were you in the /RD-SCHOOL-1/ program? [Or-]1136.1615
845ROC_se0_ag1_f_021135.8965[Yeah] I [was], yep, yep, [yep. I was in the] /RD-SCHOOL-4/1139.2387
848 1137.3765[okay, cool.]1137.9810 
849 1139.5045Okay, [yeah that's what I thought, okay.]1141.1949
850ROC_se0_ag1_f_021139.8775[Yeah, <laugh> yeah], yeah.1141.7240
851ROC_int_011141.8406Cool, so do you still talk to like, /RD-NAME-1/ and-1144.5672
852ROC_se0_ag1_f_021144.5719Uh-uh, no.1145.4578
854ROC_se0_ag1_f_021146.3671I feel,1147.1598
856 1147.8825I have a very negative view of her, cause I feel,1151.1827 
858 1151.7236like, I think she's a nice woman, but I feel,1154.7405 
860 1155.9669like-1157.0382 
862 1158.3718like,1158.6515 
864 1159.2391she tried to take over OMSA1161.1415 
866 1161.9611like the Office of Minority Student Affairs.1164.3438 
868 1164.8614And I feel like, if you're a white person and you're working on behalf of students of color,1171.1971 
870 1171.7567I think1172.2090 
872 1172.4374she doesn't bring enough humility in1174.7304 
874 1175.2060the understanding that1176.4277 
876 1176.8474you are only gonna understand our experience to the extent that we allow you1181.0149 
878 1181.4159to view them,1182.0640 
880 1182.4417and there's certain things that you n- just never gonna know1184.8524 
882 1185.1975as a white woman,1186.2500 
884 1186.5579that, uh, we have to deal with.1188.7679 
886 1189.2997And I think that once I left,1191.3700 
888 1191.5798you know, sh- it just always-1192.5952 
890 1192.8657she always made it seem that she was gonna like,1194.4650 
892 1194.8054check up on us, and stuff like that. But once I left, it was- she was only concerned1198.6978 
894 1199.0475about what fellowships I was getting1200.9127 
896 1201.2111if I graduated, and like, she was just concerned about the numbers,1204.5486 
898 1204.7677to get, like, more grants. And,1206.2785 
900 1206.8008I, um,1208.3815 
902 1209.3292yeah, I mean I- if I am on campus I'll say hello to her, but I don't feel,1212.6422 
904 1213.2064like,1213.8219 
906 1214.6659any connection to [her]1216.2187 
908ROC_se0_ag1_f_021216.4973anymore. If anything, like, I'll go talk to, like, the people in the OMSA office, like, yesterday, when I was on campus I saw Mr. /RD-NAME-1/1222.1056
910 1222.5066and /RD-NAME-4/, so I like talked to them. But I think,1224.9640 
912 1225.5355that,1226.0484 
914 1226.2198y-1226.3690 
916 1226.5928you know, she just has a lack of self awareness in my opinion, as a white woman working on these types of issues.1232.6126 
918 1233.0638Um,1233.8331 
920 1234.9149yeah.1235.4372 
921ROC_int_011235.8988Yeah [I-] I go back and [visit /RD-NAME-1/] cause he was [my advisor, so.]1239.5467
924 1237.3284[<laugh>]1237.7377 
926 1238.2986[Y- yeah, okay, yeah.]1239.8192 
927ROC_int_011240.2155Yeah but I haven't really been up there as much, unless I'm like- they ask me if I'm around to1244.7950
929 1245.0172teach a class, or something like that.1247.2926 
934 1249.7453Okay, cool.1250.6248
936 1250.9577But I find [myself-] I meet a lot of other like /RD-SCHOOL-4/.1254.4843 
939 1254.4677Uh-huh.1254.7848 
942 1255.9132in the field, [you know.]1257.3820 
944ROC_int_011257.7772Which is kind of cool, I- [like to have] that connection with other people. [Like,]1261.7121
947 1261.3976[Yeah.]1261.7143 
948ROC_int_011262.1697um, who have been through the program too, so.1264.4953
950 1264.7844Um,1265.2693 
952 1265.4652<ts> okay, yeah so, let's talk a little bit about grad school then.1268.5896 
953ROC_se0_ag1_f_021268.5563Oh, okay, ooh. [<laugh>]1270.6725
954ROC_int_011269.3027[Yeah. <laugh>]1270.6625
956ROC_int_011273.0272What, uh, made you decide to, um-1275.4781
957ROC_se0_ag1_f_021275.5177[/RD-SCHOOL-3/] actually. [Yeah], so that's why I'm not-1278.4537
959ROC_se0_ag1_f_021279.1718I don't think /RD-NAME-1/ is like a bad person, I just don't-1281.7644
961 1282.6165so and I think her in- bu- uh, but as well as other people who work on the staff, like really,1286.9344 
963 1287.3307uh, made the difference, uh, for my decision to go to grad school. But it really,1291.6194 
965 1292.0111was my advisor, /RD-NAME-8/ I don't know if you know her, [while she was] there.1296.5330 
967 1296.5796[Mm-hm.]1296.9881
968ROC_se0_ag1_f_021296.8967[So] she was the only black professor I think I had at /RD-SCHOOL-3/ maybe one of two.1302.3604
969 1303.1951Um, and so, actually, when I came in, like, I came in as a math major,1307.2926
971 1307.6377and I was- you know, you have to take other courses so I was taking political science, but it was just kind of like,1312.0803 
973 1312.7171j- just taking it, I didn't really know that I w- I would be that interested in political science.1317.1535 
975 1317.9451And so when I did /RD-SCHOOL-2/, you know, you have to have a mentor in a- a-1322.5613 
977 1322.7105a discipline. I'm like,1324.0710 
979 1324.7051I had a terrible experience in math. I lo- I really enjoyed math, but I just didn't have1328.8566 
981 1329.1955like a professor that I would think that actually would believe in my ability to do mathematical research.1334.7199 
983ROC_se0_ag1_f_021335.0463Or even just do math in general. (laughing)1336.9616
984 1337.3832Um, and so, I was like, okay, I- I don't think,1339.6288
986 1340.0857you know,1340.8038 
988 1341.0591I wanna do my /RD-SCHOOL-2/ project in math.1343.7369 
990 1344.2112Um, and so I was like, okay I'll just do political science, and okay, I'll do it with /RD-NAME-8/ she's,1349.3411 
992 1349.7335like,1349.8755 
994 1350.1165/black/ professor. Like, she's pretty cool.1351.8945 
996 1352.2676Um, and so I, um, partnered with her,1355.0362 
998 1355.4465and, um, that really made the difference, to kind of see, um, someone who looked like me, and to-1360.2342 
1000 1360.6445to see that, this is something that I could possibly1363.5402 
1002 1363.6847do.1364.0997 
1004 1364.5893And then so, I think through that experience, it really was transformative.1368.0993 
1006 1368.5097Um,1369.1065 
1008 1369.3443and so, that's when I1370.4774 
1010 1371.1022decided to- to- to ge- to possibly go to grad school.1374.6868 
1012 1374.9946The whole time I kept saying, I don't wanna go to school for another five to seven years. [Like I don't really],1379.5351 
1014ROC_se0_ag1_f_021380.0900you know, I don't know about this. But, um,1382.3562
1016 1383.1255<ts> but I1383.6245 
1018 1383.9637would go through all the steps, take the GRE, apply to grad school. Again, the whole time,1388.2443 
1020 1388.5800it's not that I'm doubting my capability of doing grad school, but it's just that,1391.6843 
1022 1392.0340the time that it took,1393.4609 
1024 1394.0204you know. It just was un-1395.2043 
1026 1395.4738imaginable for me to go to grad school, because no one in1398.3325 
1028 1398.6402my family went to college. So, I thought if I go to college,1400.8038 
1030 1401.2328I'll get like a good job after. And that will be,1403.8475 
1032 1404.0807like enough,1404.7801 
1034 1405.2044um, and so, the whole time when I'm applying to these grad programs, I'm1408.9289 
1036 1409.4139very skeptical that I'll1410.9153 
1038 1411.5635get in I- I guess, but1413.0882 
1040 1413.3249more so the fact that I didn't want to go to school for another,1416.5097 
1042 1417.0599five s- five to seven years. Um,1419.7216 
1044 1420.6119and I knew that would bring a different set of challenges1424.3095 
1046 1424.7012in that, I would be in this new place, where I didn't know anyone.1428.0061 
1048 1428.4817Um,1429.2790 
1050 1429.4282cause I dang sure was not gonna go to Rochester for grad school.1433.1621 
1053ROC_int_011434.6449[I] feel you on that. [<laugh>]1436.7118
1055 1437.4461so, uh, yeah.1439.0875
1057 1440.3045But- Yeah.1441.0133 
1058ROC_int_011441.4329Yeah. And so, um, you went to Penn, or-1444.8026
1059ROC_se0_ag1_f_021444.7704No, I- [/RD-SCHOOL-12/]1446.2725
1060ROC_int_011446.0061[/RD-SCHOOL-3/, /RD-SCHOOL-3/ okay, cool.]1447.7238
1061ROC_se0_ag1_f_021446.6128[yes, yeah,]1447.2850
1063 1447.4852[uh-huh.]1447.7966 
1064ROC_int_011448.0913Okay, and,1449.1124
1066 1449.2617so, when you made that transition, what was it like?1452.1795 
1068 1452.3147Did you like /RD-SCHOOL-3/, or, [e- or], es- especially, like, in comparison to the /RD-SCHOOL-9/. What kind of-1457.7183 
1070 1457.7260Oh, um,1458.8043
1072 1460.2032so, when I went to /RD-SCHOOL-3/,1461.6673 
1074 1462.4962I, um, did like- had like a- kind of like a- similar to like a bridge program sort of, I guess.1468.4884 
1076 1469.0091Um, cause I got this fellowship, and part of the fellowship was that1472.5203 
1078 1472.9213you could possibly go earlier1474.8972 
1080 1475.1490and1475.7505 
1082 1476.2121like, get more acclimated, and stuff like that, and I chose to do that because1479.3736 
1084 1479.7097I didn't know anyone in Michigan and so I thought this would be a good opportunity to meet other students1484.0917 
1086 1484.4880of color or just like, /minority/ students, before the semester.1487.6810 
1088 1488.1006And so, I decided to go earlier,1490.2409 
1090 1490.3994although I did wanna work to, like, make money, cause I didn't have any,1493.4058 
1092 1493.7975money to like,1494.7534 
1094 1495.1638even move1496.2785 
1096 1496.4041from Rochester to Michigan.1498.0781 
1098 1498.3969Um, but the good thing (laughing) about that program was that they1500.7237 
1100 1500.8449gave you f- uh, like f-1502.0888 
1102 1502.7462like some money to move before.1504.5111 
1104 1504.8373So, I was like, okay, cool, I'll do this. They're paying me to like,1507.2879 
1106 1507.9908take classes, or like, do research. Like, fine, I'll do this. And1511.5113 
1108 1512.0196I- I met like people in my program and stuff like that.1514.9794 
1110 1515.6462And compared to /RD-SCHOOL-3/,1518.2947 
1112 1519.1329it's so different, right? Because /RD-SCHOOL-3/ is so small. It's like,1521.9296 
1114 1522.0430five thousand students.1523.1304 
1116 1523.5984/RD-SCHOOL-3/ is this Big Ten school,1525.3672 
1118 1525.6724twenty-five thousand1526.8102 
1120 1527.0340undergrad students, fifteen thousand grad students. So, it's this massive,1530.3773 
1122 1530.8483uh,1531.4067 
1124 1532.2087campus. But it's a coll- very much a college town.1534.7313 
1126 1535.0018And Rochester, to a certain extent is sort of getting that way, with how their-1538.5491 
1128 1538.9781all the construction that they're doing.1540.5028 
1130 1540.9365Um,1541.3515 
1132 1541.6732but I think1542.9938 
1134 1543.7564that1544.2273 
1136 1545.1459/RD-SCHOOL-3/ was very different in the sense that1547.3745 
1138 1547.6173in that town, in /RD-SCHOOL-6/,1549.7284 
1140 1550.0735uh, a super majority of the population is college educated.1553.0810 
1142 1553.5333Uh, you know, I didn't see, like, neighborhoods that I saw, like, growing up, like, where I grew up it was nothing like that.1560.5219 
1144 1560.8856And so I think1561.3787 
1146 1561.5092it was very different in a sense that, like, it was not a lot of people of color.1565.1230 
1148 1565.4121It's mostly white people who are college educated in terms of the surrounding1568.3532 
1150 1568.7822area. Whereas Rochester is just very different. Although, the campus likes to1573.4952 
1152 1573.7470pretend that it's in this bubble, that somehow is1576.1438 
1154 1576.5774not connected to the Rochester community, which drives me nuts.1579.5838 
1156 1580.0222Um,1580.5211 
1158 1581.1602<ts>1581.2336 
1160 1581.2998but in terms of the actual campus itself,1583.8317 
1162 1584.8518I think that, um,1586.4651 
1164 1587.1039it was just a huge transition, because1588.8945 
1166 1589.2629grad school is just so different than undergrad.1591.1594 
1168 1591.4719You know, you don't have this advisor that's like looking out for you and stuff like that.1594.4562 
1170 1594.8152But again, I think what made the difference for me is I had that one black professor.1598.5491 
1172 1598.9501Um, who I felt was really looking out for me the whole time, throughout my1602.9881 
1174 1603.2248graduate1603.9755 
1176 1604.1714tenure.1604.7449 
1178 1605.2532Um, and so, I think that that really made the difference.1608.1302 
1180 1608.5685Um,1609.0721 
1182 1609.2061and again, it's kind of the same thing1610.8866 
1184 1611.0334in terms of1611.9433 
1186 1612.9831people questioning my ability.1614.5195 
1188 1614.6277So, I remember coming in.1615.9475 
1190 1616.2739So, political science a- actually a very quantitative program. A lot of people may not know that.1620.4426 
1192 1620.8389And so, coming in with this math background, although it was- it wa- it- you know, it was difficult to get, um,1625.5193 
1194 1625.7991I was- a- actually I had a huge advantage compared to my classmates. And so,1629.4956 
1196 1629.9769I remember1630.6292 
1198 1630.8278like, um,1631.7166 
1200 1631.9101coming in,1632.6878 
1202 1632.8913getting1633.2450 
1204 1633.4452like-1633.6960 
1206 1634.1017I didn't really like- you know, people would pair off and stuff like that. And of course all the white people work to-1638.3578 
1208 1638.6096together. And it was like, maybe, like, me and another1640.6564 
1210 1640.8032black girl and a few1641.8969 
1212 1642.3201like, uh, Asian American students.1644.3811 
1214 1644.8847Um,1645.5049 
1216 1646.4654but, you know, no one- b- even the other black gir- or,1649.1175 
1218 1649.6910not necessarily, because I actually knew her from this other program.1652.6053 
1220 1653.0389But I feel like,1653.7524 
1222 1654.0170outside of her I felt like a lot of people,1656.1480 
1224 1657.0805didn't think I could do the statistics and math work. And so when I would get the1660.9589 
1226 1662.1106problem sets done, or get the homework done, they'd be like, how do you know how to do this? I'm like oh, I have a bachelor's in math.1667.0102 
1228 1667.3646And they're like, what? You know, because no one- when you hear math, you don't see, like a black woman's face.1671.1554 
1230ROC_se0_ag1_f_021671.5743You know, and so, I think a lot of people didn't- didn't1673.6235
1232 1674.3205realize, like, that I was able to1676.6053 
1234 1676.7965keep up with the work I guess.1678.2548 
1236 1678.7025Um, and so,1679.9101 
1238 1680.3718all of a sudden, when they found that out, I got all these new friends, you know. (laughing)1683.3047 
1240 1683.6498And I remember, like, basically, like, almost tutoring some of my classmates, like in some of the1688.3349 
1242 1688.6566like, g- uh, game theory and like, very like, um, mathy classes.1693.4676 
1244 1693.8266Um,1694.6473 
1246 1695.3840you know, and then once they were- once the classes /are done/ they were gone, you know.1699.0153 
1248 1699.2670And so I- I kind of, uh, knew that, but, um,1702.2315 
1250 1703.1081it actually helped me, even though, like,1705.1505 
1252 1705.4955I knew what they were doing actually helped me to become a better student, I think, actually1709.0848 
1254 1709.5464in that I- when you're able to, like, teach something to someone else that shows that you really-1713.6498 
1256 1714.0077really know your-1715.0242 
1258 1715.2107your stuff.1715.9474 
1260 1716.5023Um, but it was a lot of similar experience. Um,1719.0658 
1262 1719.3829I think it- it can also feel more personal in grad school though, because,1723.2764 
1264 1723.7380uh, it's very much an isolated experience. It's really about you and your own work and your own capabilities, where I feel like,1730.2229 
1266 1730.7685um, in undergrad I f-1732.0543 
1268 1732.3854felt more of a1733.6234 
1270 1733.8169community in terms of the1735.7473 
1272 1736.7164day to day oppression I was experiencing. I'm like, I know that1739.9195 
1274 1740.1200like1740.4277 
1276 1740.7961everyone else is going through this too. I think it can be-1743.3404 
1278 1743.5739it- it's very easy1744.8423 
1280 1745.0102to internalize that1746.5909 
1282 1747.1038um,1747.8173 
1284 1747.9385those feelings, um, in grad school, because1750.3434 
1286 1750.6558a lot of times, people /would/ personally attack your work and, like, the things you're interested in,1754.7592 
1288 1755.2628especially if you're a person of color, studying communities of color,1758.4909 
1290 1758.9733you know.1759.5049 
1292 1759.7613When a white person does it, it's like, oh, this is so interesting and like,1763.3506 
1294 1763.6630you're so,1764.2645 
1296 1764.5816objective, because you're not black, or a person of color. And it's like,1767.7349 
1298 1767.8491no, like, you can actually do objective work and be black and like,1771.7147 
1300 1772.3442that's fine. And so I think,1773.6638 
1302 1773.9948those different things, were just much more personal in terms of1777.4852 
1304 1778.4701just trying to justify, like, why you're studying stuff. So /when like/ you know, like,1782.0780 
1306 1782.5070the other white people in your program, if they study similar things, or if they1786.0648 
1308 1786.3387just studied white people,1787.5200 
1310 1787.6968even though they don't call it that,1789.0013 
1312 1789.3417you know, they don't get these sort of question in terms of- of your motives.1792.8657 
1314 1793.2340Um,1793.9148 
1316 1794.6749so yeah, I think-1796.0318 
1318 1797.1415yeah.1797.6263 
1321 1799.6071[<laugh>]1800.4062 
1323ROC_int_011800.8520[Well, um,]1801.8374
1325 1802.3349Sorry, [that was like a long response.]1804.0042
1326ROC_int_011802.8966[no, so-]1803.8130
1327 1804.1009<laugh> [no, that was] good, um, and t- and you know me, I have to be- [ask] a selfish [question. Cause I'm] in1810.5524
1330 1808.0551[Yeah.]1808.4654 
1332 1809.4027[Sure, sure, sure.]1810.2500 
1333ROC_int_011810.7957grad school [in my dissertation phase, so,]1813.3277
1334ROC_se0_ag1_f_021811.4439[Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.]1813.2904
1335ROC_int_011813.6028[you know], how for you [was the] dissertation phase?1816.7398
1338 1815.0809[Mm-hm.]1815.4539 
1340 1816.4273<ts>1816.5157 
1341 1816.8517Yeah.1817.5185
1343 1817.6770Ooh,1818.0138 
1345 1818.6562I think that's the thing that's challenging, right? Like,1821.2954 
1347 1821.5834you go g- you get in grad school because you did well in your course work in undergrad. So like, you know how to be a student,1826.6006 
1349 1826.9270you know how to take classes,1828.3947 
1351 1828.8796you know,1829.2464 
1353 1829.3698you're amazing at that, you know, that's why you got into grad school.1831.8219 
1355 1832.1343And so I think once-1833.1788 
1357 1833.3654And I think what was also difficult for me, I actually lost my mother when I was in grad school.1836.7075 
1359ROC_se0_ag1_f_021837.1458And so, uh, that was just really challenging. Um,1840.4646
1361 1840.8843in terms of like, I've-1842.1153 
1363 1842.5443you know,1843.1411 
1365 1843.2950just in terms of that whole thing. I could talk about that later.1845.7757 
1367 1846.1114But I think, like, once you get into dissertation phase, like,1848.7215 
1369 1849.6447it is really really difficult, because you don't- you don't n- you're not trained to know how to do1854.6329 
1371 1854.8241this type of process. Um,1856.8944 
1373 1857.3560think it's just- um,1859.2387 
1375 1860.5676yeah it was just really- it's a really rough transition. Like, uh, people in my program call, like, that1864.9682 
1377 1865.5418year from taking classes to dissertation, like, the-1868.6846 
1379 1869.0296the, like, wandering year, or whatever. Because, like,1871.4951 
1381 1871.8589you know, it's like, what am I supposed to do with all this time now that I have? Like, I don't1875.9669 
1383 1876.2875have classes when I'm expected to be working all the time.1878.9313 
1385 1879.8499Um,1880.2789 
1387 1880.5400p-1880.6799 
1389 1881.1136it's just really challenging, and so for me, I think1883.7469 
1391 1885.1458it was just really hard. Um,1886.7312 
1393 1887.0343c- so, my program we have to like, write a proposal that1889.7050 
1395 1890.2179depending on your advisor, can be a substantial proposal /sort of lines/.1893.9564 
1397 1894.3854My advisor wanted, like a pretty substantial proposal.1897.1132 
1399 1897.5841And I think it was just really, uh,1899.5286 
1401 1899.8783hard, because,1901.1081 
1403 1902.1480you know, like I said, you're not taught to do this. And so, it's just1904.6706 
1405 1905.2534constantly questioning yourself. Especially because I studied black and Latino1910.1716 
1407 1910.5307politicians for my dissertation. And so,1912.8050 
1409 1914.2226you know, again, the ment- doing the mental work of, like,1916.8618 
1411 1917.8223I feel like sometimes, implicitly, or explicitly people want you to explain, like, why you're doing this work and s-1923.0734 
1413 1923.4571and sort of1924.1086 
1415 1924.3387do it in a way to make sure you cover your bases.1926.7308 
1417 1927.0899Um, constantly checking your stuff, cause again, I think- I feel like people,1930.3154 
1419 1930.9309um, think that you're doing this, or you have some kind of1933.3451 
1421 1933.5019vested interest, um,1935.3840 
1423 1935.7430to get l- s- or to see a certain result. And so I think,1938.4790 
1425 1938.9686that mental work and then also, like,1941.0016 
1427 1942.1709p- like doing different presentations, or trying to get feedback from other people1946.0318 
1429 1946.3488in our program, I think, was some- some- ch- sometimes challenging, but1949.8449 
1431 1950.1713luckily we had, like-1951.0572 
1433 1951.5561we didn't have, like, that diverse of a,1953.6591 
1435 1954.1009um, program. Like it was like maybe six other black people, out of, like, over a hundred students. It was not1959.3607 
1437 1959.7337a lot of1960.0928 
1439 1960.7491black people or- and then like, maybe one or two Latinos, but1963.4163 
1441 1963.7100I think we would get together and like, provide feedback for each other's, like,1967.9941 
1443 1968.6236um,1969.0899 
1445 1969.6168dissertation, or projects. And so, I think that really helped1972.0508 
1447 1972.3714my transition and like,1974.1899 
1449 1974.3345you know, writing the dissertation phase.1976.1064 
1451 1976.4841But it was just very challenging.1978.1021 
1453 1978.5672Um, and so, what I- I would-1980.0221 
1455 1980.2459w- what I did is just kind of made it a job.1982.2742 
1457 1982.7778And so I said, I work best in the mornings, so I would go to campus at six A.M.1987.0899 
1459 1987.5142And I would work, um, because no one was there1990.9403 
1461 1991.2807at least 'til, like, ten. So, I know at least in those four hours I can get some, like,1994.4995 
1463 1994.9224really good stuff done. And so, I just would go and work on it everyday,1998.1666 
1465 1998.5909and just come up with different, like,2000.5027 
1467 2001.0856superficial deadlines and different things that I wanted to do.2004.0127 
1469 2004.4510And make different, like, short term and long term gro- goals.2007.2768 
1471 2007.5600And that really helped me,2008.6139 
1473 2009.0009but I felt like, um,2010.3811 
1475 2010.6422because there's all this pressure to like, spend all this2013.0110 
1477 2013.4295extraordinary time, on stuff, or to stay late. I feel like people really value that in my program. And I'm just like,2018.4561 
1479 2019.1555you know, I tried to do that, but then I realized like, no. I need to do what works for me and what works for me is to- to get up really early and to go.2025.1415 
1481 2025.5472And somehow people were always impressed that I would come early, but I just like, no, I'm just going.2029.6788 
1483 2029.9805But I would also, like, leave earlier too, because at a certain point I was tired.2033.7423 
1485 2034.1853And also, um, there's just like a lot of people and stuff like that. And so for me, I just made it a job and just kind of worked on it2039.3739 
1487 2039.7190and met with my advisors and2041.8546 
1489 2042.1530kept me honest about the different goals I had, but2044.3387 
1491 2044.8423it was definitely times,2046.6282 
1493 2046.8940especially after my mom passed away where2048.8478 
1495 2049.1975it was just really difficult to,2050.9636 
1497 2051.2294try to,2052.1480 
1499 2052.7262you know, have that motivation to work2054.5540 
1501 2054.9457on that- uh, on the dissertation because there's no one like, watching over you.2059.0013 
1502ROC_int_012060.2043Yeah, yeah.2061.2861
1504 2062.0077I totally, [<laugh>]2064.2738 
1506ROC_int_012064.7541[relate, like], yeah, but I'm just kind of like, right now, in data collection, [/phase so it's just/] like,2070.8313
1507ROC_se0_ag1_f_022065.1924[you just-]2065.6820
1509 2069.3198[Yeah, yeah, yeah.]2070.4371 
1510ROC_int_012071.6681get as much as you can. [<laugh>]2073.9042
1511ROC_se0_ag1_f_022073.1089[Yeah, yeah, yeah.]2074.2047
1514 2075.1463but,2075.8770 
1516 2076.2599uh, wh- what was the question I was gonna ask?2078.4421 
1518 2078.8571Um, oh, I wanted to ask, so,2081.0195 
1520 2081.4299in your program, at what point did you decide, okay,2084.2276 
1522 2084.3815I do, or don't wanna do academia?2086.3807 
1523ROC_se0_ag1_f_022086.4273<ts> Oh, yeah.2087.4998
1525 2087.9894Um,2088.7355 
1527 2090.0458I think it was, b- when my mom passed away.2092.9216 
1529 2094.5536Um, so for me,2095.8779 
1531 2096.1157I think it was /sure/2097.2581 
1533 2097.4679I think so, I think initially,2099.1594 
1535 2099.4905I began questioning it maybe2101.3696 
1537 2101.8499when I started writing my dissertation, I got more familiar just kind of with2105.8262 
1539 2106.3391the trajectory of the people of color in my discipline in terms of2110.5078 
1541 2110.9822them2111.4159 
1543 2111.6770having2112.4557 
1545 2113.7287everything they needed2114.8944 
1547 2115.1975typically for tenure. And then actually2117.2294 
1549 2117.9381not getting it2119.0945 
1551 2119.2997a lot of times. And2120.7172 
1553 2120.9877it was very clear that,2122.4460 
1555 2123.5744um,2124.1573 
1557 2124.7075you know, it- in part, I think it was because2127.3654 
1559 2127.9191of them being a person of color, /sending/ people of color, and then2132.0038 
1561 2132.1716just maybe, pure racism2134.0555 
1563 2134.2175and discrimination.2135.2387 
1565 2135.6350Um, and so I think2137.4552 
1567 2138.3675for me it was hard because2140.2500 
1569 2140.6885a lot of the professors that I would see, with the exception of my advisor, there was actually not a lot of senior black2146.4087 
1571 2146.8983professors, or l- Latino professors, like they would often not get tenure and things like that.2151.1882 
1573 2151.7264And then,2152.3245 
1575 2152.4542more than that,2153.5403 
1577 2154.2444I think it was just when I taught.2156.3527 
1579 2156.9710I did2157.3767 
1581 2157.5585fine teaching, but it was just2159.6988 
1583 2160.0485challenging,2160.8925 
1585 2161.2609uh, not in terms of the work,2163.4047 
1587 2163.5259but in terms of the mental capacity.2165.1486 
1589 2165.6009Um, because being a black woman, um,2168.2354 
1591 2168.7565you know, people don't expect you to be a professor, you think professor, you think of a old white man, you know. You don't think of a black woman with a afro.2173.8671 
1593 2174.4173Um,2175.2100 
1595 2175.5679and, you know, I just /?/2176.4911 
1597 2176.7616they would just challenge me with dumb stuff and I'm like, I don't want my job to depend on eighteen and nineteen year olds.2182.5937 
1599 2183.1766Um,2184.1185 
1601 2184.6640but then more than that, I felt like as a professor, I thought the impact that I could make-2189.4796 
1603 2190.1760um, given like the things that I've been through, I thought the impact that I could make,2193.4260 
1605 2193.8410on the lived experience of people of color I thought was very limited, in terms of,2198.2416 
1607 2198.5400you know, these certain, uh, students of color actually being able to even make it to this level2203.6401 
1609 2204.0271of graduate school, or undergrad.2205.9995 
1611 2206.3306Um, so I just wanted to make a larger impact on, like, social justice issues. And I felt like,2211.2581 
1613 2211.6498it would be very difficult to do that, from the perspective, of being a faculty member.2216.3302 
1615 2216.7452And so I think it's just all these different things at once and I feel like,2219.4933 
1617 2219.7656when I lost my mom,2221.0712 
1619 2221.3976I think I- it- it kept me honest about a lot of things it- it showed me the- how limited our time is2226.8474 
1621 2227.0293and- uh, on this earth and- and like what we wanna do to, like, make a impact. And so,2231.6677 
1623 2232.3141<ts>2232.3942 
1625 2232.7215I was like, I don't wanna be a professor. So, I gotta be honest about that. And so,2235.8969 
1627 2236.3865I think for me,2237.7236 
1629 2238.0407um,2238.8381 
1631 2240.7032I knew I could do it, but I just didn't want to.2242.9368 
1633 2243.4392And I think I'm okay,2245.2362 
1635 2245.3626w- with, uh, living with that decision.2247.5612 
1637ROC_se0_ag1_f_022248.0344Uh, and I think it probably disappointed, um,2250.6096
1638 2251.0806some of my faculty members.2252.6706
1640 2252.8525But thing about it is, like, this is my life2255.2531 
1642 2255.6117and I have to choose how I wanna live it and what kind of impact I wanna make.2258.7898 
1644 2259.1742And it's not to say that I don't think it's purpose, in terms of diversity with faculty members. I think it's2264.1472 
1646 2264.4514super super important. I wish I had more,2266.5404 
1648 2266.8470uh,2267.2667 
1650 2267.5511p-2267.6304 
1652 2267.7535fa- faculty of color when I was at /RD-SCHOOL-3/, e- or especially in grad school too, but,2272.0182 
1654 2272.5684um, I just2273.4159 
1656 2273.7656didn't feel like,2274.7402 
1658 2275.5375<ts> um,2276.0831 
1660 2277.3514that was the means in which I could-2279.3273 
1662 2279.8682I wanted to make my impact.2281.5328 
1664 2281.9339Not that you can't, but it's just challenging.2283.9576 
1666 2284.2793Especially my- my discipline is just an old white man's club.2287.3230 
1668 2288.3535Um,2288.8664 
1670 2289.5146yeah.2289.8503 
1673 2291.2993[/inaudible/. Mm-hm.]2292.6811 
1674ROC_se0_ag1_f_022291.5214[Academia in general.]2292.6049
1675 2292.9453Um, it just- it tra- attracts a- a different kind of personality. I think in some ways I have some of the2298.1620
1677 2298.4417personality traits of an aca-2299.9158 
1679 2300.0358academic, but I2301.0110 
1681 2301.6918also care about social /jus-/ justice issues. And I feel2304.7635 
1683 2304.9313like,2305.3836 
1685 2305.8872um, you know, you're not2307.3327 
1687 2307.4306r- if anything you're- you're punished for,2309.6211 
1689 2310.0034um, speaking out about those things, especially as a2312.8012 
1691 2312.9457faculty member that's not tenured.2314.8401 
1693 2315.5091And, um,2316.5769 
1695 2318.0458yeah, I just didn't want it.2319.1695 
1697ROC_se0_ag1_f_022320.9170I didn't wanna do- I- I could do it, but I didn't want to.2323.4629
1699 2323.8080I think dealing with those students was really a profound moment.2326.9041 
1701 2327.3131You know, having- having students ask me,2329.1924 
1703 2329.5562can we- can you, uh,2330.8944 
1705 2331.3604do a review before the quiz?2332.8527 
1707 2333.0242No, I can't do a review before the quiz.2334.6749 
1709 2335.1272Or, um, you know, s- uh, one student like copied from Wikipedia.2339.0300 
1711 2339.4566And I caught him.2340.1759 
1713 2340.3578He said he2341.1785 
1715 2341.8055made that entry to Wikipedia.2343.3037 
1717 2343.8690Like, you know, just like,2344.8621 
1719 2345.2480really? You know, (laughing) so, just2346.9966 
1721 2347.8592like I said, the- the-2349.0529 
1723 2350.3865the just mental capacity it takes, to just be challenged2354.0597 
1725 2354.7359in every single way. Not- not in terms of your-2357.6630 
1727 2357.9903your ability, which I'm actually okay with, /cause/ people being j- but- but just2361.8034 
1729 2362.1438you know it's because of who you are. And you knew that if you were a white man, or even just a man of color that,2367.7148 
1731 2368.0365perhaps you won't get challenged in the same ways.2370.7245 
1733 2371.2260And I think2371.8927 
1735 2372.0280that for me,2373.5003 
1737 2374.0645I cannot just grin and bear it, like, this is something that I would wanna2377.1933 
1739 2377.5384speak out about and, you know, as a-2379.5376 
1741 2380.1018not having your job security [yet,]2382.7011 
1743ROC_se0_ag1_f_022383.1700uh, you can't really do that. Um,2385.0398
1745 2385.3371so, I just decided that was something-2386.8989 
1747 2387.1976wasn't something for me. But it's weird because with the job I have now,2389.9953 
1749 2390.3823I still go to the same academic conferences, that, uh,2393.9343 
1751 2394.3307you know, I see my, uh, graduate student- my fellow gr- former graduate students, um,2399.0577 
1753 2399.5473and undergrad sometimes even. But like,2402.0047 
1755 2402.0933fa- faculty members I still see them. Like, I just came back2404.3303 
1757 2404.7733from one before I came home.2406.4742 
1759 2406.7245Uh,2407.0581 
1761 2407.9223so, it's weird.2409.0305 
1763 2409.5469And it's funny because, um,2410.8992 
1765 2411.5753<ts>2411.6732 
1767 2412.1162you know,2412.7545 
1769 2413.3938they are looking at me like, why are you here? Basically, like, you didn't get a academic job so they maybe think that I'm trying to, like, apply for academic jobs, cause,2420.9093 
1771 2421.3091that's a major conference in my discipline. So, you would go there if you're, like, on the job market.2425.0627 
1773 2425.5104And I remember,2426.2658 
1775 2426.6388people asking me /??/ conference, like, how is life? But they would ask it in this way that's like,2430.7643 
1777 2431.2633are you sad? Like, are you disappointed in that2434.4609 
1779 2434.8712you didn't get, like, an academic job? Like, literally that's I feel like,2438.3311 
1781ROC_se0_ag1_f_022438.7775how they're asking the questions, and it's like,2440.5774
1782 2441.0530no, I'm actually very good, I'm very happy, and I really am. Like, I'm not putting on because, like, they're no one to put on for.2447.0950
1784 2447.5799Um, but2448.2514 
1786 2448.5778I definitely2449.4158 
1788 2450.1539got this feeling that somehow,2451.9060 
1790 2452.1718I should be2452.7080 
1792 2453.0670disappointed in myself, because I didn't go to academia.2455.8088 
1794 2457.5562Um,2457.9946 
1796 2458.7593yeah.2459.1743 
1799ROC_int_012460.1581So, this new job [is in]2461.5077
1802ROC_se0_ag1_f_022462.2145[Yes, mm-hm.]2463.1471
1803ROC_int_012462.3126[right? And-] okay, can you tell me a little bit more about,2465.2162
1804 2465.7571um,2466.3447
1806 2466.9648the new job, as well as, how you like2468.7181 
1808 2468.8941living in DC in comparison [to /inaudible/ <laugh>]2472.4642 
1811 2471.6266[Oh yeah.]2472.7588 
1813ROC_se0_ag1_f_022473.1060[So-] um,2474.0326
1814 2474.3311so, I've been working there for about2476.2046
1816 2476.3212five, or so months.2478.4053 
1818 2478.7317So, I actually- I finished my dissertation in March,2481.2811 
1820 2481.5749end of March, and I moved, like, less than a week later, to start the job.2484.6291 
1822 2485.0721Um, so I'm currently a research director at /RD-WORK-3/, which is a nonprofit that works on voting rights, voting registration.2490.6478 
1824 2491.0534Uh, I work with mostly lawyers who do, like, a lot of litigation and suing state governments.2495.8131 
1826 2496.2328I basically help provide the research to- and the motivation for their, um,2501.2769 
1828 2501.7851legisla- um,2502.6151 
1830 2502.9369their litigation2503.9155 
1832 2504.1002pursuits.2504.7321 
1834 2505.1335Um,2505.7875 
1836 2505.9943so, just providing evidence of discrimination, whether2509.0394 
1838 2509.2260implicit or k- e- explicit2510.9827 
1840 2511.4024in terms of the end results of people of color and how they're rejected a lot of times for voter roles2516.3870 
1842 2516.8813and they probably think that they're registered to vote, but they're not.2518.9598 
1844 2519.2349Um, also do like,2520.4345 
1846 2520.5706different grassroots stuff, and help2522.2005 
1848 2522.5782support smaller nonprofits who are doing,2524.5357 
1850 2524.6758um, voter registration.2525.8084 
1852 2526.4706Um, and then I travel and do some- some training2529.0678 
1854 2529.2578and helping smaller organizations become2531.0391 
1856 2531.4028more effective in how they do voter registration and2534.6388 
1858 2534.8242providing like, different,2535.9153 
1860 2536.3676uh, ways they can collect data on that. And like, re-2539.3651 
1862 2539.7455like, re-2540.3561 
1864 2540.8666structure how they maybe do voter registration.2543.0362 
1866 2543.2030Um,2543.6825 
1868 2544.4985so that's basically what I do.2546.5316 
1870 2547.3324Um,2548.2137 
1872 2548.4515what else did you ask? Sorry.2549.7002 
1873ROC_int_012549.7198Oh, [um, /sorry/, yeah. <laugh>]2551.8756
1874ROC_se0_ag1_f_022550.0405[Oh how I like DC.]2550.9514
1876 2551.2650[Oh, um, so] DC, I love DC, cause it's- it's like,2554.0085 
1877 2554.3396it's so many,2555.4307
1879 2555.7618black per- young professionals and so that, yeah, just-2559.2250 
1881 2559.9526I don't know, I feel like I-2561.5100 
1883 2561.8364um,2562.2514 
1885 2562.5176it's really cool just to see.2563.8741 
1887 2564.2611And, um, it's just very different in Rochester, cause I felt like,2567.9437 
1889 2568.3447at least like, the people I went to high school and stuff like that, it's like, you know,2571.2250 
1891 2571.8360a lot of black people, but not necessarily a lot of black professionals (laughing).2574.4612 
1893 2574.7690And where in- in Ann Arbor, Michigan, where I went to grad school, it's just like,2578.3583 
1895 2578.9971you know, mostly all grad students, and so, they come from different backgrounds. I actually feel like2583.5189 
1897 2583.9852I didn't relate to a lot of them cause they- they come from, like, very /pivi-/ privileged backgrounds.2588.0559 
1899 2588.4698And actually had a difficult time, like, meeting or relating to people actually, other black students even sometimes, at /RD-SCHOOL-3/.2593.9207 
1901 2594.4570But then, um,2595.6029 
1903 2596.2279in DC I just feel-2597.6546 
1905 2598.2467I actually feel real at home, like, being there and I feel like, <exhale> I met a lot of people that2602.5028 
1907 2602.9503kind of relate to like, my experience and they're still like,2605.7946 
1909 2606.2656um, working on very c- like, cool things. Um, and2610.2419 
1911 2610.7129yeah, I met a lot of, uh, friends, like, from church and stuff like that. So, I really like living there.2615.6590 
1913 2616.0305It's expensive, but I really like living there. (laughing)2618.4568 
1915 2618.9137And I really,2619.4919 
1917 2619.7018uh, like the work that I'm doing. Course, you know, there's always stuff about jobs or-2624.0231 
1919 2624.3868and stuff that you don't like, but I think overall, I really like living there.2627.7570 
1921ROC_se0_ag1_f_022628.4051[Yeah, <laugh>]2629.2884
1922ROC_int_012628.7641[Okay], cool.2629.8589
1924ROC_int_012630.3915Okay, cool. Um,2631.7437
1926 2632.0462<ts> I just wanna turn back to s- a few [more] general questions [about Rochester]2636.3995 
1929 2635.4449[Mm-hm.]2635.7855 
1930 2636.5267[Mm-hm.]2636.9697
1931ROC_int_012636.7431[and] that's more so as a person who has moved away and2640.2885
1933ROC_int_012640.6522coming back to Rochester,2642.0317
1935ROC_int_012642.3160[what do] you see are some like, major changes to you, that has happened in the city?2646.5660
1936ROC_se0_ag1_f_022647.0719Oh, um,2648.1630
1938 2651.8269Just like, you know, a lot of gentrification,2654.5629 
1940 2654.7031you know.2655.1469 
1942 2655.7810Uh, that's the one thing I definitely notice.2658.0461 
1944 2658.5263You know, definitely noti- Like we were saying earlier, all the Wegmans moved out the hood2662.1755 
1946 2662.5159into the suburbs and just noticing like a lot of,2664.9732 
1948 2665.9233um,2666.5621 
1950 2666.7859/RD-SCHOOL-3/ taking over everywhere. Like, the college town,2669.5634 
1952 2669.8588like it was so different, cause like everything was just in that bubble and then now they took over, like, that Mount Hope area.2674.8796 
1954 2675.2697It's like a lot of,2676.0577 
1956 2676.5240um, /RD-SCHOOL-3/.2677.5486 
1958 2677.7455Um,2678.2446 
1960 2678.7364it's funny cause I came back for my high s- ten year high school reunion and just kind of2682.4727 
1962 2683.1721seeing like, people I went to high school with just kind of,2685.5642 
1964 2687.0738you know, doing the same things, working, like, these menial jobs, actually made me feel pretty sad.2691.9233 
1966 2692.4773And I often feel2693.2998 
1968 2693.5233really guilty I guess. Um, especially2695.8342 
1970 2696.2865more so with my family,2697.6488 
1972 2697.8206uh, cause they really struggle financially.2699.9604 
1974 2700.3114And I2701.1549 
1976 2701.5794supported them like, for- like, even in grad school2704.2055 
1978 2704.4999I found ways to support them financially, but I don't really do it,2707.1492 
1980 2707.8450as much, um, so, that's really difficult I think. Um,2711.9717 
1982 2712.7190and it's also hard, because people- when I come home, people expect me2716.2791 
1984 2716.6414to be the same person, talk the same way, talk about the same things.2720.3040 
1986 2720.7569And so I think it's always really challenging coming home.2723.8132 
1988 2724.3057And, um, ev- each time I come home, I'm ec- excited initia- initially with this2728.9415 
1990 2729.1997feeling of nostalgia and,2731.2964 
1992 2731.6420um, wanting to meet- wanting to meet up with everyone.2734.4320 
1994 2734.7999But I feel like soon after2736.3057 
1996 2736.4925those few days, especially after my mom passed away,2738.9267 
1998 2739.2772I'm ready to go.2740.3414 
2000 2740.4716And I feel really bad about that, but I- I- I usually am ready to go.2743.9021 
2002 2744.9545Uh, just because, uh, it's really difficult for me to see my family struggling, and I have the means to help them, but then,2751.7980 
2004 2752.4829how do I help them2754.0572 
2006 2754.2073without enabling them? And I feel like that's what I'm2756.3323 
2008 2756.7337doing often times so I- it- it's- it's actually really challenging to come home. And then when I come home,2760.8095 
2010 2761.2341its just, everything's different, I have to G- GPS to get around everywhere.2765.0943 
2012 2765.5868Um, especially like the social stuff, like the clubs, they always change names,2769.2998 
2014 2769.7074close and stuff like that. I'm not really into that, that's what /they're/ trying to do, and I realize that2773.1718 
2016 2773.6077everything's just so different, um,2775.7527 
2018 2776.7094yeah.2777.2698 
2019ROC_int_012779.0756Yeah. [<laugh>]2781.1435
2023 2782.4999and- but are there any-2784.1529 
2025 2784.4642when you come to Rochester, I guess, what are your favorite things to do here?2787.5772 
2028 2790.3623really just like meeting up with people I guess. There's nothing,2793.2149 
2030 2793.6621uh, in particular I mean, g- I guess going to Wegmans if I have to pick something.2797.0303 
2032 2797.4436Um, but really just kind of- of meeting up with people.2801.3717 
2034 2801.7566I mean, sometimes I go to campus, too.2804.0436 
2036 2804.2299Like I went to campus yesterday, but it's usually,2806.2735 
2038 2806.5565connected to,2807.7849 
2040 2808.4189um, something in particular.2810.3380 
2042 2810.4568Um, like, the2812.0187 
2044 2812.3414Black Student's Union had the event, or2814.2661 
2046 2814.5095maybe vi- visiting the, uh, Office of Minority Student Affairs or something like that.2818.4829 
2048 2819.0433Um,2820.1982 
2050 2822.9998yeah.2823.3677 
2052ROC_se0_ag1_f_022823.8659I don't come home that often, like I said, because of2826.2407
2053 2826.5774it's just really- mentally, uh, it's, really difficult.2830.0018
2055 2830.4856Um, because like- you know, mom- so my mom passed away when I was in grad school. And so,2834.0210 
2057 2834.3488w- when I come home, it's like I expect to see her and then I can't see her, [so that's just]2838.3906 
2059ROC_se0_ag1_f_022838.6963very difficult. And then, like I said earlier, my family and stuff like that, um,2842.0728
2061 2843.1056so I guess,2843.5868 
2063 2844.0453you know, it's- it's such a weird thing. So, I come home, I'm all excited,2847.7074 
2065 2848.2961uh, about twenty-four hours, I'm ready to go because of the stress2851.8059 
2067 2852.1229and the- the mental exhaustion and stuff.2854.5339 
2069 2854.9018Cause even when I come home, it's not really home, because2857.6360 
2071 2858.1002I have to stay with, like, a family friend because2860.4376 
2073 2860.7207my b- like my brother and sister and my nephew and stuff live together, but they don't2864.4455 
2075 2865.2828have like space for me to even stay there, and so often I don't- I never, this-2869.8115 
2077 2870.2191this is, like, always my home, but I never feel at home anymore,2873.3094 
2079ROC_se0_ag1_f_022873.8076um, since my mom passed away.2875.2398
2081ROC_se0_ag1_f_022875.8342Uh, so it- it's just- yeah, it's challenging.2878.4999
2084 2879.2030/it/ makes sense.2880.1306 
2086 2880.5243Uh, let's see,2881.7688 
2088 2882.0670<ts>2882.1383 
2090 2882.3261okay, those are2883.8885 
2092 2884.0697m- uh, my last few questions about Rochester [specifically], like as a place. [But]2888.9370 
2095 2888.5701[Mm-hm.]2888.9210 
2096ROC_int_012889.1283I always, um,2890.3819
2098 2890.5926ask a few questions at the end about2892.9341 
2100 2893.2681uh, language related stuff, [so.]2895.4905 
2101ROC_se0_ag1_f_022895.1187[Oh] sure, sure.2896.1659
2103 2897.9774sort of, um, have you been told, that you have an accent? <laugh>2902.4523
2104ROC_se0_ag1_f_022902.4943[Oh yeah, definitely.]2903.6108
2105ROC_int_012902.8218[Um, being from] Rochester? And2904.6737
2106 2904.8378maybe what things do people say2907.0113
2108 2907.2319make them think you have a accent?2908.0742 
2110 2908.2752think you have a accent?2910.1132 
2111ROC_se0_ag1_f_022910.1106It's usually more- People don't know where the heck Rochester is a lot of times.2914.2735
2112 2914.5339Like in- even in DC, like, some people do, some people don't.2917.3020
2114 2917.7153But I think,2918.4172 
2116 2919.0224they think I have like a New York C- New York City accent, but then it's like-2923.1718 
2118 2923.9700it's just only, like, with certain words, or-2926.5452 
2120 2926.7886but they kn- they know it's like a little bit different. So, they're like, uh, I d- can't quite place her accent.2932.2735 
2122 2932.6924And I think it's a little-2933.8132 
2124 2934.0170and I think I'm sure I have like,2935.3417 
2126 2935.7096a little bit of a Michigan influence, um, because I lived there for six years, possibly.2940.0397 
2128 2940.5831Um,2941.3247 
2130 2943.0720but yeah. I don't-2943.7619 
2132 2943.8850I don't think everyone- no one has ever specifically said, you have like a Rochester accent.2948.0361 
2134ROC_se0_ag1_f_022948.3870I think it's in terms of like, the Black English, in term of the slang words as in things I might use. Like, mad, or-2954.4210
2135 2954.7720or, you know, different things like that. Um,2956.9741
2137 2957.2231they're like, oh, you know, that's like a New York2959.5266 
2139 2959.9398slang word like, where are you from kind of thing and this usually comes2963.2076 
2141 2963.9647in conversation where I'm talking to other black people. Like, I think w- white people don't understand what Black English is, or2969.4269 
2143 2969.7439understand what slang is. I think they just /dismiss/ it as it being like an2973.1001 
2145 2973.5079ignorant2974.1985 
2147 2974.4533thing, versus, like, a actual dialect.2976.5643 
2149 2977.5775[Um],2978.1266 
2154 2979.8075Okay. And, um,2981.4043 
2156 2981.6149<ts>2981.6829 
2158 2981.9704let's see,2982.8546 
2160 2984.2682when you come back,2985.4796 
2162 2985.6154and you- like, you haven't been here [/for a little while/ do you feel] like there's certain people, maybe who lived in certain /[parts] of the city/ like they talk differently, or?2995.4185 
2163ROC_se0_ag1_f_022987.3080[Uh-huh. <laugh>]2988.2591
2165 2988.6265[<laugh>]2989.2718 
2167 2992.2608[Uh-huh.]2992.6627 
2168 2996.0891Yeah, I think-2996.9831
2170 2997.2903I- I feel like I'm usually2999.2061 
2172 2999.6755like a little lost if there's like- uh, like, new words, but I definitely feel like3003.8702 
2174 3004.4759the way I talk is very different too. Like,3006.9435 
2176 3007.3001I- I- I was thinking about this,3008.7720 
2178 3009.2079um,3009.7230 
2180 3009.9551actually3010.7259 
2182 3010.9461yesterday. Or like the last few days I'm hanging around3013.7111 
2184 3014.0338my classmates from3015.5344 
2186 3015.6381s- high school. And I definitely feel like3017.9619 
2188 3018.5054talk very different when I'm around them.3020.3338 
2190 3020.7301Um, you know, that code switching is- is very unconscious.3023.7128 
2192 3024.1827Um,3024.8393 
2194 3026.0847and then like,3026.8037 
2196 3027.4716you know,3028.0774 
2198 3029.8261like for example, like, they'll just- they kept bringing up the fact that like3033.5929 
2200 3033.7226I'm a doctor now.3034.7340 
2202 3035.3279Um,3035.7802 
2204 3036.0805so-3036.7078 
2206 3037.1564and some of them actually don't really know what that means in terms of Ph.D. versus medical doctor.3041.4298 
2208ROC_se0_ag1_f_023041.8269And so, um,3042.7997
2209 3043.0601like,3043.3488
2211 3043.5153it-3043.7221 
2213 3044.1866it'll com- it would come up in the most stupid way. Like,3046.6661 
2215 3047.1467um, oh I need to know how to work, like, the stereo for my friends place, where I wanted to like, listen to like,3051.9245 
2217 3052.2925more R- R and B soul and not like Future, and I didn't really like3055.7904 
2219 3056.6395listening, like, sitting down and like having that as like the background music. And they're like, oh, it's because you a doctor now.3061.8300 
2221ROC_se0_ag1_f_023062.0847[you know, and stuff] like that and I'm just like, uh, not really.3065.3449
2222 3065.5260Um,3066.0695
2224 3066.5393and- and things like that, I feel like, um,3068.8772 
2226 3069.4207there's definitely this constant effort to-3072.2223 
2228 3072.6639to-3073.0261 
2230 3074.4810to make me feel different [now, or to] expect that I'm different now.3078.1827 
2232ROC_se0_ag1_f_023078.4318Or to expect that the reasons why3080.4640
2234 3080.8320I may have a different opinion about something, is because of somehow it's related to the-3085.1450 
2236 3085.4167to the amount of3086.0394 
2238 3086.4810education that I've received.3087.9811 
2240 3088.5071Um, like for example, a lot of pe- most all the people I went to school with, have kids.3092.3043 
2242 3092.8939I don't have kids. And I don't have kids because I'm not married. And when I say that,3096.4034 
2244 3096.9073that really, s-3097.8489 
2246 3098.0625strikes a chord with them an- and- an- and so,3100.8019 
2248 3101.1184when they ask me questions it's really about3103.0375 
2250 3103.4281kids,3103.9262 
2252 3104.2319they'll ask que- a question about3105.4738 
2254 3105.6974whether you have kids or not.3106.6548 
2256 3106.8580Or n- no, it's /?/ really actually not a question of whether you have kids or not, it's how many you have, right? So this expectation3111.8226 
2258 3112.1849that you're-3112.7793 
2260 3112.9599you're twenty-eight like somehow you should have kids.3115.0827 
2262 3115.5300Um, and to tell them, like, I don't have kids because I've been in school for a long time,3120.5902 
2264 3120.9752basically since we've got out of high school,3122.8036 
2266 3123.0867uh, is very perplexing to them.3124.9548 
2268 3125.1241Uh, they don't really get it.3126.5676 
2270 3126.9752Um,3127.5696 
2272 3127.9205and so,3128.8603 
2274 3129.7433um,3130.6208 
2276 3131.0505I f- often feel bad3132.5450 
2278 3132.9299by saying that, but that is why and so when people ask me, so, I think,3135.8509 
2280 3136.4849uh, it's just really, uh, <exhale> challenging.3139.6545 
2282 3140.1979Um,3140.7357 
2284 3141.5565yeah.3142.2585 
2286ROC_se0_ag1_f_023143.9109Sorry I don't know if I answered [your question, okay.]3146.0904
2287ROC_int_013145.3828[No, yeah, yeah.]3146.5528
2293 3148.2924yeah, so that's basically all the questions I have related to [language, and]3152.8772 
2295ROC_int_013153.2452um, I always like to ask, uh,3155.7807
2297 3156.1770if you have any maybe last thoughts, you wanna say? If not then3160.4283 
2299 3160.7788we can wrap it up.3161.7581 
2302 3166.8184no.3167.3052 
2303ROC_int_013167.5713Yeah? okay cool [well-]3168.9080
2304ROC_se0_ag1_f_023168.4827[Yeah if] you have- if you need me to clarify something, or- I'm happy to do that, [but.]3172.5528
2305ROC_int_013172.2151[No], I think that is [/gonna be/ really good. <laugh>]3175.0415
2306ROC_se0_ag1_f_023173.5713[Okay <laugh> okay. <laugh>]3175.3658
2307ROC_int_013175.3431Um, but do you consent to [me-]3177.2770
2308ROC_se0_ag1_f_023176.9904[Oh, yeah] yeah, [yeah, transcribing it, you] can call me if I3180.2107
2309ROC_int_013177.7150[Okay, always /have-/ mm-hm.]3179.6449
2310ROC_se0_ag1_f_023180.7148wasn't clear on something, or- if I messed with the microphone at some point.3184.7959
2311ROC_int_013185.0618[Okay, cool.]3185.9166
2312ROC_se0_ag1_f_023185.3331[I'm fine with that. <laugh> yeah.]3187.0374
2313ROC_int_013186.1239[thank you, cause I] always have to [/inaudible/,]3188.8332
2316 3188.6678[Yeah], yeah, yeah, [I- I] get it.3190.1905